Draft Tracker Feature Request

crucified  3/14/2015 12:01 AM

Tonight I did my first baseball mock draft this year of with the Baseball Monster draft tracker (it was a snake).  I had previously done drafts over the last couple years and used Basketball Monster most recently.  I found myself feeling like things were not working that great for me and I missing something, like I was drafting blind or naked or whatever.  I realize that it was the dynamic values column being missing.  In basketball I found that I used this column constantly and this may be more important in baseball given there are more diverse stats with pitcher and hitters.  Is there any way we can get this ported over as soon as possible?   I have drafts in about a week to prep for and I would like to have some mock trials too.  

Also I have found the graphs from a couple years ago very helpful to show all the position players and their value.  This shows obvious tiers, scarcity of players, relative values of positions, and probably more.   I would have felt better about the draft if I had that tool.  

Both these ideas are great and are needed.   I don't want to have to develop my own tool this year but I could and share it with the community.  The tool would use the exported data and then execute a macro to show dynamic values and also a chart.  

ken_admin  3/14/2015 7:58 AM

The Dynamic Value shouldn't be too hard, and I'll check on the graph option too. Thanks

crucified  3/14/2015 11:14 PM

Thanks Ken, that would be great!  I want to see within a few days, but any ETA's you can share would help me, as I'm investigating doing this myself.  Graphs are not as important as I was able to live without them for recent drafts but definitely something I value.  

BTW: I see another feature that I didn't mention that Basketball Monster had and I realize but would be very helpful, under Value: Use Replacement Players.  The importance of this is clear (copied from Basketball Monster but changed max games to 162): "Normalizes all players to 162 games, filling in any projected missed games with replacement-level production at the player's primary position.  For roto, replacement players are based on the number of players started in the league; for h2h, replacement players are based on the number of rostered players in the league."

ken_admin  3/15/2015 8:29 AM

The Dynamic Value has been added, and I'll look into getting replacement players updated too.

For others reading this, keep in mind Dynamic Value only makes sense for category-based leagues so you won't see the option if you have a points-based one.

tomm0  3/15/2015 10:53 AM

I don't recall seeing a graphs feature.  Did it show all positions at once?  I've always hoped for some kind of view with a table showing each position in a separate column to see obvious value drop offs and tiers.

crucified  3/15/2015 11:34 AM

The graph feature showed dots for each player on a line for each position (it was there a couple years ago via a checkbox before it was removed).  So each position had it's own colored line.  The Y axis was a positive value and the X was the number of players.  What the positive value was, is a question for Ken.  It gave the info you talked about, to see obvious drop offs in value when looking at a single position.  On the down side, it was small and a bit cluttered with all the position ON, but you can unselect positions.  I envision graphs to be a huge part of advanced drafting where you can see what is going on and see what players stand out.  If you could zoom in, hover and see player names and info.  For auction you can get values for auctions and see the actual auction values and predict costs better.  For my system I could dedicate a screen to the graph.  Adding a line for tiers wouldn't be hard if it's not obvious from looking at it (it would be nice if Baseball monster allowed custom tiering during drafts by the way).  

Ken, thanks for adding the Dynamic Value column (for cats only).  I'm sure this will be helpful.  I'll have to try it out soon in a mock draft and see if I feel better about things than last time.  I recall that Basketball Monster had Dynamic Value for both Cats and Points leagues.  I drafted using in twice in points leagues (leaning on it heavily) and don't remember it being a problem.  Did you weight the points accordingly and so it worked?  

Also thanks for working on the Use Replacement Players for the draft.  This will be quite helpful in baseball.  It would be good to get that in Ranking and Projections too.  

Why not mention another feature request.... Basketball Monster allows you to more easily select players to sort on.  Instead of the table of positions using he buttons that is hard to use in a fast draft, have actually buttons.  Copied from Basketball Monster "AllPG (3)SG (4)G (6)SF (4)PF (5)F (8)C (6)"

crucified  3/15/2015 8:22 PM

I was able to execute an 10 team Yahoo mock auction draft today using the newly added Dynamic Value.  I sorted on it but I didn't noticed much difference from the regular value, for a while at least.  The diff between values and position values were so much greater so it seemed like Dynamic value wasn't that significant and I ended up considering that more.  Later in the draft I did notice there was more of a diff.  I'm guessing that drafters follow the Yahoo O-Rank/ADP which minimizes any dynamic value difference.  Non standard drafts might show more variance. 

As soon as there was enough data, the Projected Standings didn't help me and seemed incorrect during the draft.  I had to abandon it and use the Yahoo Projected Standings so all was not lost. I still won the draft according to Yahoo but I wasn't able to manage the draft as well as I wanted.

Here is a screenshot (DraftTracker_1.pdf). My quick in draft sanity check of the Projected Standings: My HR total is only 30 and they guys on my team which was much greater than 30.  Later in the draft I took another screenshot and compared with Yahoo the HR totals were off (if you want another data point: DraftTracker2.pdf).  I didn't have time to analyze it more during the draft but the differences made me loose confidence and I didn't have time to think much more about it. 

There could be some more features that could help (all seen in Basketball Monster):

• Categorical Scarcity - The availability of each of your leagues stats within the remaining player pool.  The larger the negative value the more scarce the stat.
• Summary (vs Drafted) - Your values relative to currently drafted players.  This tells how you currently compare to other teams drafted
• Summary (vs Top Players) - Your values relative to the top <#> players These values will typically start high as you draft good players and rop as you add worse players. 
• Showing total money spent for Hitters and Pitchers.  The individual #'s are there but they aren't totaled.  Should be easy to add that I imagine.
• Ability to select cats to punt

My draft ended up being an exercise to maximize value vs. being able to find balance like my Basketball Monster draft.  At least I was able to get max value which allowed me to "win".  

ken_admin  3/16/2015 6:13 AM

Here's a brief update:

• The graph is back, and there's a checkbox to display it in the upper-left.
• I checked your account, and your Projected Standings should show total stats now.
• Adding the total $ spent should be easy as you mention.
• Summary vs. Drafted looked a little odd with baseball since you can split picks between hitters and pitchers.  I'll see if there's a way to make this more useful.
• Cat. Scarcity shouldn't be too hard to add either.

Thanks for the details.

crucified  3/16/2015 12:45 PM

Thanks Ken, I appreciate your quick response and being willing to add those features.  I did a mock draft over my lunch break and found that the Projected Standings totals are looking better.  However, I didn't see the graphs added yet but can't wait to see them. It would be great to see these features you can add.  The 2015 Basketball Monster interface is better and it includes everything I mentioned, but I'm assuming that can't be easily ported by this weekend.  I assume I don't need to prioritize what features I would like to see but I just want to make sure that Use Replacement Players is up there.  It also may be good to have a checkboxes for hitters, pitcher, or both, since they can be replaced differently in leagues. 

After 3 drafts I see we could use a buttons to select hitters only or pitchers only, like with the rankings or projections.  The reason is the stats line is so long with both in one view it goes off the right side.  If you can select one or another at least then you can see these columns.  Maybe there is a better way to view all the stats but it's all but impossible to use anything off the screen.

ken_admin  3/16/2015 12:57 PM

Thanks again, and for the graph, you need to check "Show Graph with Rankings".

descender  3/16/2015 2:55 PM

The Dynamic value column looks amaaaaazing. :D  

Is it safe to sort by the dynamic column and draft that way instead of using the regular rank/value column?  PosV is dangerous to sort by, and always has been... but this looks to be a more subtle change.

Also... ADP doesn't seem to be figured into the draft tracker in any way, is that correct?

ken_admin  3/16/2015 3:30 PM

Drafting by Dynamic Value is a good approach, but yes, Positional Value should be used for display purposes and not drafting order.  ADP is also there for display only and does not affect the rankings.

tomm0  3/16/2015 3:34 PM

So is dynamic value affected by positions, stats, or both?

ken_admin  3/16/2015 3:38 PM

Dynamic Value compares all of the remaining Top Players in your draft.  For instance, if Stanton is drafted, everyone else's HR-value will go up since there are less home runs in the remaining pool.

tomm0  3/16/2015 4:13 PM

Okay, awesome!  Thanks

manbearpigs  3/16/2015 11:09 PM

As always, I pay for a season of Baseball/Basketball Monster, and the added value just keeps on piling up. I would make a request, but they've already all been covered.

I hesitate to say this, but the pedant is strong in me today: the graph has discrete data and a continuous x-axis. I just know I'll get halfway through a draft and start obsessing about mixing and matching half players.

Please put that on the bottom of your request list. The very bottom.

Thanks for all the improvements.

descender  3/17/2015 11:37 AM

Would it make sense to use the PosV column for points leagues?  I play a league that gives drastically more points to hitters than pitchers, but you are required to have a full roster... so weighing their stark point difference at draft time is difficult.

ken_admin  3/17/2015 7:52 PM

Looking at your settings, pitchers are definitely worth much less than hitters.  How has this panned out in the past? Does getting all hitters first and then getting pitchers last work best?

I'm not sure PosV is the answer here since you may not want to equate the two if hitters are that much more valuable.

consiglieri  3/17/2015 11:51 PM

hi i tried using draft tracker for a mock draft but i cant seem to find the area where to input the Yahoo ID, any help on this?

ken_admin  3/18/2015 5:04 AM

The option to enter a league ID is only shown if you have Yahoo! set as your Position Source under League Settings. I have changed this for your Mock league so you should be set.

crucified  3/19/2015 12:40 AM

I was able to do another mock draft, and the graph looks like I remember it, which is great.  When you deselect positions it become even more powerful as it's easier to see the position value drop off.  It will help for pre-draft planning too.  The new buttons to sort on position are great too.  They allow fast sorting / refreshing, which is wonderful.  Speed of refresh is the key to getting data fast when you need it.  Also perhaps it would be nice to have a couple extra buttons on the bar to select Only Hitters and Only Pitchers on the bar: Show AllC (0)1B (1)2B (0)SS (0)3B (0)DH (0)OF (2)SP (0)RP (0)

During the draft the link to League Settings is missing and you have to close the draft and then navigate over to the settings. Then you have to navigate back and reconnect.  It takes way too long during an auction draft (which can happen when you spend too much and need to increase your $1 players).  Basketball Monster had a way to change settings without closing the draft I thought.  I did notice that Projected Standing show your comparative stats which gives similar data to the "Summary (vs. Drafted)", so perhaps you can balance your league with that (while waiting for "Summary (vs. Drafted))".  

Having the draft tracker keep track of the auction team and league money and perhaps adjust auction values dynamically was something that I saw a post on in 2014.  https://baseballmonster.com/MessageTopic.aspx?topic=543.  Yahoo keeps track of the all data but it doesn't make it into Baseball Monster.  Something to put on the bottom of the queue perhaps?  I'm assuming it won't be there for my draft on Sat. but one can hope.  I'm looking forward to the new features and checking more than once daily.  

Cgruwell05  3/19/2015 10:34 PM

So for a Head to Head Categories leagues which column or feature would be most beneficial in a draft?

tsfloyd  3/20/2015 9:54 PM

I think two helpful features would be to have a hitters only and pitchers only button, in addition to each position.

Also, it would be interesting to be able to enter decimal values for positions.  I'd like to enter 1.3 for catchers instead of just whole numbers.  Is that possible?

descender  3/21/2015 10:46 AM

I'm really digging this DynV column, but it doesn't seem to keep my leagues position depth in consideration at all?  I've tried reconfiguring the league a few different ways (including leaving 0 bench spots unaccounted for, which i'm really starting to like more and more) and it always recommends more RP's and OF's than I have spots assigned for.  Is there a better way to decide when to jump on certain positions using these tools that I am missing?

edit:  The commish in that points league keeps changes those points every year (CHS is the league i'm talking about) so I have no idea how it will play out.  Pitchers were worth way more last year, to the point where there was no reason to roster most 2B/SS/C at all.

ken_admin  3/21/2015 12:19 PM

The DynV is only looking at stats and not positions.  For positions, keeping an eye on PoV and checking ADP for players should guide you on when to draft them.

tomm0  4/2/2015 9:06 AM

So the graph is nice, and while I'm sure it's way too late for this season, I always envisioned a view that had each position in a separate column along with maybe their total value, site ADP, and whatever else (can't have too much since you'd want to see all positions without having to scroll horizontally).  This would make it very easy to see obvious positional drop-offs during a draft without having to filter by each individual position.  Just wanted to get this out there before forgetting.  Thanks for all of the changes you put in place between the opening of the site for this season and today.  My last draft is tonight!